the why of it all

[Teranfirbt]

Hmm, I never got spanked and I turned out fine..
But then again I didn't have TV, playstation, DVD player, etc in my room, I had a bed and books... When I was bad my parents sent me to my room and I got bored out of my mind (I had read each book at least 15 times) so I made sure to not do what it was I wasn't suppose to so I never had to be bored like that..

[SothThe69th]

I had a nintendo, and a T.V., and not a shit ton in the way of discipline either, hell, I was even lacking a strong male role model. I don't think I'm any worse for the wear, maybe a bit more of a misanthrope, but one has to wonder if that was an ingrained personality trait, or a result of my environs.

Whatever.

[BillyBlaze]

All this crap about "You never do this" or "You should always do this" is completely wrong. It has nothing to do with the "What" you're doing, it's the "When, Why, and How" that matter. Beating your kid isn't globally wrong. It's when you do it with a cain because he spilled his milk. And at the same time, you can't reason with a 5 year old when he's mouthing off and screaming like a brat. And it has nothing to do with age either, because different children age different ways and respond differently to different punishments. Some you CAN reason with at younger ages, others you can't reason with, EVER. And I think until parents start thinking more about the when, why, and how children are going to just keep getting crappier and crappier as people. As is they're starting to depend on psychology expects to diciplin their children, let the almighty Television teach them their morals (while at the same time the parents surrender their own morals to the judgment of a commitie and the lable they slap on a product. These are the same people two rated Twiser PG-13 for graphic depictions of bad weather.) and the show them the role models they should grow up to be. And the flip side is just as extreme, when you sacrafice your judgement to the Bible and beat the fear of God into them. The one global thing these all have in common is that the parents relinquish responsability of their job as parent to something or someone else. Despite all the crap that children are raised around, and how crappy things may seem, hor how inexperienced a person may be, the one best thing anyone can do as a parent is step up and admit that they ARE the parent, at start taking responsability for it (and all that that entails.) THAT is what makes the difference, more than anything. And failing that, just giving a damn. You'd be surprized how big a difference that, in and of itself can make.

[tannii]

My mum beat me when I fucked around at the start of high school. I was a little shit to my parents and teachers so my mum beat the crap out of me and left bruises and scars on me. Now I'm a nice little girl.
My friend's mother is buddhist and never his her daughter. Now her daughter is the epitome of evil bitch. She's rude and disrespectful and treats her friends badly.

I'm all for beating children.

[Rorschach]

Yes, I think a good parental smack now and again is permissable
If I mouthed off to my mother, I was going to bed with a red imprint of my father's hand on my rump and the nagging sensation that being rude to ladies isn't the smartest move in the world.
Discipline is now sadly lacking in more than the home though, teachers can hardly raise their voices to kids nowadays, seventeen year olds are happily breaking the law with impunity as they know they can't be considered fully responsible for their actions and wee guys harasss me at every turn knowing that if I break and volley them, it's me who gets in trouble
*sigh*
We need a war to think out their ranks

[Princess_Lorien]

There is no such thing as a fucking healthy beating.. Your child shouldnt have to be hit to get the idea of punishment, When i worked as a nanny, it was concequences.. You jump off the couch and break a vase, you go to your room and dont get any toys (yes i would drag all the toys out of the childs room to make a point) You draw on a wall, i make you clean it off and give your crayons to younger brother or sister.

As soon as you get angry with a child, it has the upper hand. You are upset. They arent, Stay calm and mention consiquences.. i used to find the child would learn to ask what the consiquences were and think whether or not its worth doing or not.

Anyway, i dont wish to have children, i was dragged around by the hair by my mentally unstable mother for protecting my brother from her regular beatings.
*shrugs* My opinion doesnt count really, continue on as you normally would.

[Azurain]

*shrugs* My opinion doesnt count really, continue on as you normally would.

Bah! Other than the hair-dragging mother bit (I had great parents...) I'd say you stated my opinion on the subject much more eloquently than I would have. Modesty (false or otherwise) does not become you : ). Also, on a mostly unrelated note, I've oft said that having had bad parents is not a good reason to not want children, as if you're conscious enough to realize that they were bad parents, you're almost certainly capable of being a better one by far, and the world needs more good, intelligent parents.

/me shrugs...

Perhaps I'm just tired. I'm going to go watch the sunrise, then go to bed.

-- Chris

[tankkisankari]

I'm so sorry

Headmaster: Well now, Mr.Perkins. It was good of you to come in. I realise that you're a busy man, but I didn't think this matter could be discussed over the electric telephone.

Mr Perkins: No. No, absolutely, Headmaster, I mean, if Tommy is in some sort of trouble, then I'd like to nip it in the bud.

Headmaster: Well, quite frankly, Tommy is in trouble. Recently his behaviour has left a great deal to be desired.

Mr Perkins: Dear.

Headmaster: He seems to take no interest in school life whatsoever. He refuses to muck in at the sports field. And it's weeks since any master has received any written work from him.

Mr Perkins: Oh, dear me.

Headmaster: Quite frankly, Mr Perkins, if he wasn't dead, I'd have him expelled.

Mr Perkins: I beg your pardon?

Headmaster: Yes, EXPELLED! If I wasn't making allowances for the fact that your son is dead, he'd be out on his ear!

Mr Perkins: You mean he's dead?

Headmaster: Yes... He's lying up there in sick bay now, stiff as a board and bright green, and this is, I fear, typical of his current attitude. You see, the boy has no sense of moderation: one moment he's flying around like a paper kite, and the next moment he's completely immovable. And beginning to smell.

Mr Perkins: Well, how did he die?!

Headmaster: Well, is that important?

Mr Perkins: Why, yes, I think so!

Headmaster: Well... Well... Well, it's all got to do with the library, you see. We've had a lot of trouble recently with boys taking out library books without library cards. Your son was caught, and I administered a beating, during which he died. But you'll be glad to know... You'll be glad to know that the ringleader was caught, so I don't think we'll be having any trouble with library discipline. You see, the library card system...

Mr Perkins: Well, exactly what happened?

Headmaster: Well, apparently, boys were just slipping into the library and taking the books!

Mr Perkins: No, during the beating!

Headmaster: Oh, that? Well...well, one moment he was bending over, the next moment he was lying down, I mean, er...

Mr Perkins: Dead?

Headmaster: Mmm... deadish! ... Mr.Perkins, I find this morbid fascination with your son's death quite disturbing. What I'm talking about is his attitude! And quite frankly, I can see where he gets it from.

Mr Perkins: Well, it wasn't me that beat my son to death!

Headmaster: Well, that was perfectly obvious to me from the first day he arrived here. I wondered then, as I wonder now, if he might not have turned out a very different boy indeed if you had administrated a few fatal beatings earlier.

[Rorschach]

As soon as you get angry with a child, it has the upper hand. You are upset. They arent, Stay calm and mention consiquences.. i used to find the child would learn to ask what the consiquences were and think whether or not its worth doing or not.

It's a simple enough task to physically remonstrate with your child whilst being calm. I've smacked a toddler cousin of mine, on the bottom, just once, and not even particularly hard, because he was about to make a run across a busy road. I had no problem explaining this to his parents and they had no problem with my chosen course of action.
Rather a bruised posterior and pride than something far worse.

Anyway, i dont wish to have children, i was dragged around by the hair by my mentally unstable mother for protecting my brother from her regular beatings.

I am sorry. Really, it's a moot point but I am. But this is child abuse. Not child discipline.
If the crime outweighs the punishment, I'll smack my kids silly. I they associate playing with a bottle of bleach with some posterior pain and that stops them doing it, I have no problem with that at all.
Lesser 'offenses' that are less dramatic, sure, I'll try a chit-chat about what they've done, but only if the consequences of them doing it again are not quite so serious.

[Ender_Wiggin]

Its not impossible nor improbable to raise a kid without laying a hand on them when they've done something wrong, but rather sitting them in a time out or something similar.

[katie_spade]

Is any one here who is commenting a parent, or has ever been one?

I personally think a good slap in the rump or up side the head as a last resort is totally acceptable. Beating to the point that every other word is followed by a slap is not how things are done. Spankings done all the time are as ineffective as is time out all the time. You have to keep your kids on their toes. If they get to use to one form of punishment they soon learn ways around it. Take my 4 year old for example.... she's not perfect but she's a damn good kid. I give her time outs take away her toys, count to 3 (btw if you follow up with a punishment at 3, it will work), and spank her ass or slap that sassy ass mouth she can be blessed with. My kid wouldn't dream of telling me no, she might try to convince me that she has a better way though. My daughter says please, thank you and excuse me. She generally does as she is told. She is unafraid of telling an adult your aren't my mother. And the kid will and has defended herself.

It’s about repetition, following through even though you don't want to. It’s about the kisses and hugs and the praise. It’s about knowing that small things can become big ones. And knowing when kids will be kids and letting go. If you respect your kids space and right to be one while showing them right from wrong you will find that they will respect you.


Children learn from there parents... if you don't respect or care they won't either

[Gowerlypuff]

I think a bit of physical punishment helps. I was spenked when I was young, but I learnt to block and self defense, so they resorted to taking away TV, etc. This made me kind of respect my parents, but... eh. It only doesn't work if you're a spiteful little brat who holds a grudge all your life and won't realise it's for your own good or it's taken too far and you're beaten for anything and everything.
I find it sickening that parents are taken to court for spanking their child.

[Azurain]

I find it sickening that parents are taken to court for spanking their child

That I'll agree with. I mean, I was spanked for major infractions as a child, and certainly don't think it was a bad thing on my parents' part (I wasn't exactly an easy child to raise in some respects). At the same time, I don't think it's *necessary* and believe that in most instances where it is used, it would be better to find some nonviolent form of punishment.

-- Chris

[confusedcious]

There is, I think, a line where it is ok, and where it isn't.
Those who repeatedly hit children, hard around the face, and for non-disciplinary purposes are wrong, IMHO. However, a moderate slap on the backside is within the realms of ok.

[BillyBlaze]

the sad (or good?) thing about consisten severe beatings is that the children develop pain tolerance to the punishment. So while you start off with your hand in the begining, it can get to the point where you're wailing on them with leather belts and paint stiring sticks and they just shrug it off.