Why are hats disrespectful? Silly tradition, or what?

StruckingFuggle · Post by **StruckingFuggle** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 2:29 am

The question comes from a discussion with someone else, earlier. She couldn't produce an answer beyond "it is", so I decided to seek elucidation here, thinking someone could maybe tell me why it is that wearing a hat is bad manners inside, and disrespectful when you're supposed to be showing respect.

Anyone got answers?

Deacon · Post by **Deacon** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:14 am

Depends on the culture and situation. Some religious require a man to cover his head in church while forbidding women from doing so, while in others it seems to be the other way around.

AskAndy wrote:Tipping of the hat is a conventional gesture of politeness. This hat tipping custom has the same origin as military saluting, which came from the raising of medieval Knights face visors to show friendliness.

Also see the Village Hatshop.

StruckingFuggle · Post by **StruckingFuggle** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:22 am

Specifically, it came up in regards to walking around some building that's in memorial of the military dead at A&M, or somewhere like Arlington, but there's also the national anthem, etc ...

Still. There's a lot of saying "it's polite to do X" or it's "respectful/disrespectful to do/not do" this, but still nothing about WHY, which is what I'm trying to figure out.

Fundamentally, what's the point or cause of it mattering what is or is not on your head, here or there?

Deacon · Post by **Deacon** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:27 am

Cultural and religious traditions, often carried down through generations to where the origins are speculative at best, or lost altogether at worst. It probably goes back to a time when you had kings and knights and such that would bare their head in respect for an authority figure (i.e. a king), much in the same way that you would look down at the floor or your toes when bowing at the waist in most places in Asia instead of keeping your eyes on them: a sign of respect and trust in that person.

StruckingFuggle · Post by **StruckingFuggle** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 3:55 am

Hm. It's certainly possible, and hearing from more people, it does seem to be a baseless bit of sillyness ... I see.

mikehendo · Post by **mikehendo** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:27 am

I already sent you the link.. but for anyone else who cares, go here: http://www.bcvc.net/hats/

Accer · Post by **Accer** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:40 am

Not all communication happens through words. It's common for a language to have not just words with set meanings, but gestures with set meanings as well.

If it's convention to take off your hat to communicate respect, I don't see how that's any more silly than speaking any given word of politeness – unless you don’t want to make that communication.

The only time it would be silly is if it is someplace where most of the people don’t see hat-removal (or continous hat wearing) as carrying a meaning. Perhaps this would be the case at a friend's house, or at school. Given that meaning can become lost or washed out, I can see how wearing a hat does not mean anything in some places-- but if you take off your hat at a memorial, you are saying something to the present families of the military.

StruckingFuggle · Post by **StruckingFuggle** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:47 am

Hm. To say, I do know of nonverbal communication, but ... I dunno.

Accer · Post by **Accer** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:50 am

Well, it's not cool to stand up on top of a wall and go, "Hey, all you people that know someone who died! You got my respects, yo!" Much more simple to take off the hat. That's why certain gestures survive.

naval_aviator_2040 · Post by **naval_aviator_2040** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:52 am

in the navy, and probably the rest of the military, you do not wear your "cover" indoors unless you are "under arms" or when you are eating even if out doors. I'm not exactly sure why but I think the eating thing is kindof a way to show repect to the people you're eating with. its supposed to be a relaxed atmosphere and the wearing of hats is to formal i guess. I really don't know but will try to find out.

StruckingFuggle · Post by **StruckingFuggle** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:55 am

Accer - but WHY does it say that?

I can grasp the fact that it does, but not why it does, other than that it used to at one time.

Accer · Post by **Accer** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 4:58 am

Why do we call a dog a dog? Why do we say 'help!' when we are in trouble, instead of 'boogie!'? The history of the gesture has already been posted mulitple times. Why does any word mean anything? That's what makes it part of the *language*.

StruckingFuggle · Post by **StruckingFuggle** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 5:02 am

Because those ones are functional, but there's no point to the hat thing, beyond spiritually crusty old men being crusty old men.

Accer · Post by **Accer** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 5:06 am

So then there is no point in telling someone, "I'm sorry for your loss," at a funeral, or saying, "Thanks," when someone hands you something, or saying, "Hi, how are you?," when you see someone for the first time in a while. It seems to me all those phrases are equally as functional, and your beef is with being polite rather than the fact that are gestures that means something.

StruckingFuggle · Post by **StruckingFuggle** » Mon Mar 21, 2005 5:08 am

Hm. I'd disagree as to their degrees of functionality being equal.

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Why are hats disrespectful? Silly tradition, or what?

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