Texas Man shoots 2 thiefs while on the phone with 911

[Deacon]

I can't tell if you're being sarcastic in that second line or not, but yes. If that first line is truly the case, then yes, yes you are.

[Shyknight]

There's a part of me that likes being a dumbass. Innocence necesitates a certain amount of ignorance.

And Shyknight, I don't think you're gonna make any progress. Deacon's bloodthirsty and vengancial. He'd just love to teach them a lesson they'd never live to learn.

You'll eat those words when the end of the world comes and none of the crazy Texans are willing to share their canned food and ammunition with you. The liberals will be the first to die.

[adciv]

You do know they used to hang horse thieves, right?

Used to. Past tense. Thank godzilla we've grown more civilized since then.


Edit: I did indeed mean "thank".

Last I heard, stealing a horse was still a hanging offense in Texas.

[Shyknight]

If that's the case they should really extend that to cars, which are today's horses.

[Deacon]

There's a part of me that likes being a dumbass. Innocence necesitates a certain amount of ignorance.

So does suffering and oppression. I just hope you never have to lose a loved one to a criminal who's invaded your home, a criminal invading your home who you assumed was reasonable, rational, and peaceful.

[Shyknight]

Um... me too?

*locks door*

[StruckingFuggle]

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C'mon, you know I had one. Back a month or so ago when I missed the mini-gathering at your place I asked if anyone would mind if I brought my licensed gun...

And they told you that you should be firing warning shots around the neighborhood??! I don't believe you. Not even for a second. You're under no moral or legal obligation to do so, and doing so incurs only risks, no rewards, and is far more likely to justify them shooting you in their own defense.

Well you wouldn't fire a warning shot if they had a gun drawn already... And if they could go from standing there unarmed, hands on a TV or up (as I said, the feasability of a warning shot depends on the situation, the nearby presence of something safe to shoot into like a compost heap or grassy lawn), to shooting you in the time it takes to fire and chamber another shell and move the gun again - isn't that past the border into one of those 'action movie shootouts' that you're fond of insisting don't happen because no one could possibly be in a situation where they would need some sort of other holster over an ankle holster, which couldn't be drawn from in that time?

And no. They didn't say to do so - But at the same time they also said not to.

And I disagree on the no reward thing. If it's possible, I think that there is a 'moral' obligation to give fair warning; the reward is that you might end up not having to shoot someone you didn't have to shoot. I'd consider keeping unnecessary blood off my hands a very big reward, personally.

I would suggest that you go fornicate yourself with the barrel of your firearm, but I'm not sure you'd think it as unpleasant as I would first assume.

Hey, friction's friction.

[Deacon]

as I said, the feasability of a warning shot depends on the situation, the nearby presence of something safe to shoot into like a compost heap or grassy lawn

Holy GOD you are never allowed anywhere NEAR my house with a firearm, sir! A compost heap?? Even in the rare case that such a thing exists, are you truly under the impression that your round(s) cannot go right through it? And a grassy lawn--especially in south Texas--masks rocks and gas lines and god knows what else. It may be safer than, say, firing at the wall next to you, but is still a remarkably bad idea.

And no. They didn't say to do so - But at the same time they also said not to.

Then listen to them. Don't do it.

If it's possible, I think that there is a 'moral' obligation to give fair warning; the reward is that you might end up not having to shoot someone you didn't have to shoot. I'd consider keeping unnecessary blood off my hands a very big reward, personally.

Your fair warning should be verbal, NOT discharging your firearm.

[StruckingFuggle]

And no. They didn't say to do so - But at the same time they also said not to.

Then listen to them. Don't do it.

/facepalm

Ack. I meant "didn't say NOT to."

If it's possible, I think that there is a 'moral' obligation to give fair warning; the reward is that you might end up not having to shoot someone you didn't have to shoot. I'd consider keeping unnecessary blood off my hands a very big reward, personally.

Your fair warning should be verbal, NOT discharging your firearm.

[/quote]

On the other hand, despite your attitude towards the matter and your seemingly looking for any excuse to pull the trigger, you may be on to something, because it's not really feasable and really if they want to assume that a spoken threat isn't going to be followed through on...

... it'd be nice if there was a way to discharge a clear warning shot, but since that's hardly ever the case, I guess I've got to agree. So long as there's A warning given, verbal should ... suffice.

[Deacon]

Would it really go through the dirt its buried under

You don't know what's in that compost heap, what's behind it, etc.

On the other hand, despite your attitude towards the matter and your seemingly looking for any excuse to pull the trigger, you may be on to something, because it's not really feasable and really if they want to assume that a spoken threat isn't going to be followed through on...

Why do you assume I'm looking for any excuse to pull the trigger? I hope I never ever have to do so throughout my entire life. We've been through this. I don't know why you continue this kind of ad hominem (slash) straw man attack against me, to try to dismiss what I'm saying by painting me as some sort of bloodthirsty lunatic simply because I place the value of my own life and that of my friends and family above that of a criminal invading my home and have expressed my willingness to do what I hope I never have to. Do you think it's an effective tactic?

... it'd be nice if there was a way to discharge a clear warning shot, but since that's hardly ever the case, I guess I've got to agree. So long as there's A warning given, verbal should ... suffice.

I don't know any who would disagree with you--assuming you would also agree that a warning of any sort is not always feasible nor even "morally necessary" even in your eyes (such as when facing someone with a weapon drawn on you).

[mikehendo]

How is the death of 2 people hilarious? Seriously? Sure he has the right to defend himself and his property, but there is nothing funny about it.

Not death.. Just shot.. For those of you who care though, there is a link to the 911 tape with the article..

[Dr. Tower]

A 61 year old man from Pasadena Texas shot and killed two burglars breaking into his neighbor's home.

Shot and dead.

[Nukinblackmage]

I know I'm gonna catch flak for this, but I hope that the old man gets indicted and convicted. He had ZERO reason to go outside. He had ZERO reason to fire upon those men. He had ZERO reason to take a life. As soon as they entered his home and as soon as he felt that the life of himself or his loved ones were in danger, he would have had a right to use deadly force. UP UNTIL THAT POINT, he had no right whatsoever to go outside and kill those two men. It was unlawful and unwarranted. He did the correct thing, the legal thing, by calling the police. He then proceeded to do the wrong thing, the illegal thing, by stepping outside and killing two men. I don't care if they were in the commission of a criminal act or not, his life was not in danger. He was only endangering himself and his neighbors by this foolish act. He is not a "hero", he is, as Deacon and Ender will remind us time and again of the two men whom he killed, a criminal.

For those of you who will bash me and say that he isn't a criminal, let me point you to what he did. Homicide.

§ 19.01. TYPES OF CRIMINAL HOMICIDE. (a) A person
commits criminal homicide if he intentionally, knowingly,
recklessly, or with criminal negligence causes the death of an
individual.
(b) Criminal homicide[0] is murder, capital murder,
manslaughter, or criminally negligent homicide[0].

Bolding mine. He intentionally and knowingly caused the death of two individuals.

[StruckingFuggle]

I'd bold the reckless part, too.

There's a difference between being thrust into a situation where your life is in danger and going out trolling for trouble by inserting yourself into a situation where your insertion will probably turn violent.

I can't listen to the 911 call at the moment, since I'm in a computer lab with no sound, but I'd be interested in the site and action facts of the case. Something about getting the drop on them with a shotgun, giving a warning, and then having to shoot them both - that just doesn't sit right. I'm sure it's easy for some of us to write the thieves off as idiots who 'went hostile', but he snuck up on them and had a loaded shotgun - and when you're being faced down with a loaded version of one of the meanest close-quarters weapons in the whole world, something most of us have a gut-deep visceral lizard-hindbrain-freezes reaction to, and you make legitimately threatening hostile motions, especially if you have been (and they should have been) notified that 911 has been dialed, that the cops are already on the way...

... that he had to shoot, and that he did nothing to knowingly, willingly, or even just negligently exacerbate and escalate the situation to one where violence was either called for or could be passed off as such in the absence of no witnesses - on it's own that doesn't quite seem right, at face value.

It's like he went in, if not wanting to shoot, then at least planning to, and thinking that it was the only possible and reasonable outcome to an extent that it influenced his actions to a lethal degree.

[adciv]

§ 19.01. TYPES OF CRIMINAL HOMICIDE. (a) A person
commits criminal homicide if he intentionally, knowingly,
recklessly, or with criminal negligence causes the death of an
individual.
(b) Criminal homicide[0] is murder, capital murder,
manslaughter, or criminally negligent homicide[0].

Bolding mine. He intentionally and knowingly caused the death of two individuals.

Kindly post the link to this so we can look at the rest of the code. You see, this section also includes Justifiable Homicide. However, that portion is not defined in this particular part you posted.