Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

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Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by Martin Blank » Sun Jul 20, 2008 2:52 am

On Monday, Zimbabwe will issue a Z$100,000,000,000 treasury note to help its people cope with the official inflation rate of 2,200,000%.

Those are not typos. The official inflation rate is 2.2 million percent, and the central bank is issuing a note valued at 100 billion Zimbabwe dollars. Both numbers are being scoffed at by people outside of the government, with foreign economists suggesting that the actual inflation rate is many times higher, and citizens complaining that a cheap lunch alone costs Z$500 billion or more.

The country's planted farmland has dropped in half in terms of area. Exports have essentially stopped, and a great deal of the food available is donated from abroad. The official unemployment rate is 80%. Political violence is common, leading millions to flee the country for the relative safety of South Africa. Even there, safety is not guaranteed, as recent mobs have attacked Zimbabwean refugees, and hundreds are suspected to have been attacked and killed by lions as they cross the open land between cities. Others have fled for work in places such as Dubai and the UAE.

There seemed to be a little bit of hope in the last elections. When the official results announced that Morgan Tsvangirai had won a plurality, leading Robert Mugabe by about five percentage points with an absolute majority in parliament, it seemed that a weakness had been found. But then came the voter intimidation and outright fraud, some of which was taped, ensuring that Mugabe would take nearly 90% of the vote. No foreign head of state -- even those who are nominally Mugabe allies -- attended his inauguration.

Zimbabwe frustrates me. It's an example where something clearly needs to be done, and yet, it's a purely domestic affair. No one has made charges of genocide. No military forces have entered or exited the country. No treaties have been broken. Is there anything at all that can be done?
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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by adciv » Sun Jul 20, 2008 3:25 am

Zimbabwe is a poster child for how not to do things. The forced land redistribution wasn't the start of the problem, but it did make it worse. Mugabe has only come up with worse ideas since then.

The cynic in me says the US should stay completely out of it. I've read of people blaming "The West" and the US in particular for Africa's problems, so I say we give them this chance to sort it out themselves.

The realist in me, says the only way to fix this is to collapse the government entirely and start from scratch. Pretty much, the entire economy and country has collapsed. Everything needs to be reestablished from the ground up. Perhaps using another countries currency, which can not be printed by the local government, would work. This would be an interesting exercise in economy building. I'd argue the first thing that needs to happen is for the Agriculture industry to rebuild itself to ~1980 levels and then work on industrial capacity. There other main problem seems to be environmental, between the loss of forest lands and wildlife.

From the CIA world factbook, they have coal, chromium ore, asbestos, gold, nickel, copper, iron ore, vanadium, lithium, tin, platinum group metals. All that would help, if they could mine it properly.
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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by StruckingFuggle » Sun Jul 20, 2008 3:38 am

adciv wrote:The realist in me, says the only way to fix this is to collapse the government entirely and start from scratch. Pretty much, the entire economy and country has collapsed. Everything needs to be reestablished from the ground up. Perhaps using another countries currency, which can not be printed by the local government, would work. This would be an interesting exercise in economy building. I'd argue the first thing that needs to happen is for the Agriculture industry to rebuild itself to ~1980 levels and then work on industrial capacity. There other main problem seems to be environmental, between the loss of forest lands and wildlife.
You need social engineering and some sort of social oversight, too, though - and possibly first. Last thing you want is a case of "meet the new boss, same as the old boss".
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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by adciv » Sun Jul 20, 2008 4:16 am

What do you mean by "social engineering" and "social oversight"? I'm not too clear on the terms, other than as a method of convincing you to give me your bank account login details.
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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by StruckingFuggle » Sun Jul 20, 2008 4:20 am

You need to teach the people to make better choices and not be corrupt, and then ensure that the same sort of people don't take over again, or the new people don't make choices that lead in the future to a similar situation. The biggest problem in Zimbabwe is the people, and you won't fix anything, or even make lasting improvements, until you fix the people.
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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by adciv » Sun Jul 20, 2008 4:47 am

Ah. Now I understand. Unfortunately, that can take a generation. For that, I reference the USA around 1900 with the robber barons, mining towns with 'script' and various other things. I wonder which needs to come first, or if they both need to happen simultaneously. Either way, Zimbabwe isn't the only country that needs that in the world today.
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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by Makh » Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:24 am

I remember some months ago I read inflation was 125,000% in Zimbabwe. Now it is 2.2 million percent and 80% unemployment sound almost incredible. It is an ecomomic aberration, a new record in history. When I read about the situation in Zimbabwe from global perspective, I wonder why the country did not collapse yet. Mugabe has really become a cancer for his own people. The country was not in bad shape when Mugabe reached power. What he has done with it is unbelievable. Nothing is stable in Afrika, even models of stability like Egypt, Ivory coast and now Nigeria, knew many great troubles.
adciv wrote:From the CIA world factbook, they have coal, chromium ore, asbestos, gold, nickel, copper, iron ore, vanadium, lithium, tin, platinum group metals. All that would help, if they could mine it properly.
I agree, the problem, like many other Afrikan countries, is that the profit does not benefit the country, just a few men.

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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by StruckingFuggle » Sun Jul 20, 2008 6:28 am

adciv wrote:Either way, Zimbabwe isn't the only country that needs that in the world today.
I agree wholeheartedly.

I just felt it bore mentioning that if we're discussing how to 'fix' Zimbabwe, this aspect of the problem bears mentioning.
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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by Hirschof » Sun Jul 20, 2008 7:38 am

With so many problems where the hell do you start? Almost makes me think the best option is to bomb the place to hell and let them start over.

Fuggle is right (-shudder-). There needs to be a massive social change somehow. Whether that change develops internally or externally (foreign involvement) is the question.
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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by ampersand » Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:31 am

A lot of the African interior has had problems. Most of it came from essentially violence against various clans that pre-existed the European desire to remake Africa during their colonial period. I read one story about how a famed Olympic middle to long-distance runner from Kenya who died because of a Kiyuku - Kalenjin tribal conflict where because "He was 10 days older than Kenya, so he'd been Kalenjin a little longer", he was shot down.

Zimbabwe seems to be no different, although there hasn't been any recurrence of any insurgency that has plagued countries like Ethiopia, Uganda, Somalia, and many others. Mugabe's military and police forces probably has a lot to do with that.

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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by jessicaabruno » Sun Jul 20, 2008 4:20 pm

StruckingFuggle wrote:I just felt it bore mentioning that if we're discussing how to 'fix' Zimbabwe, this aspect of the problem bears mentioning.
I'm with you on this, struckingfuggle. Its not only them, but the others as well because I feel the world is still an mess.

Do know that most likely will never happen.

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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by JermCool » Sun Jul 20, 2008 10:29 pm

I'm starting to warm to the idea of a unity government that's being touted by South Africa and other nations trying to diplomatically resolve this crisis. I'm beginning to think that's the only way they can solve this matter internally. But Mugabe should be no where near it.

Why Mugabe's own supporters are still standing behind him after dragging the country into economic collapse is beyond me. OK, yes, he was a revolutionary anti-colonialist. That was TWENTY YEARS AGO! Now he's a crazy old man who can't take responsibility for his own actions. "It's the West's fault." Perhaps. But that's because the West doesn't like you. Get out of the way so your people can actually make lives for themselves again.
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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by Deacon » Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:08 pm

If we do something, we're interfering, nosy imperialists practicing nation-building. If we don't, we're heartless sons of disgusting fat whores. Personally I think Africa is one giant tragedy and cannot wait for that backwards hellhole either rights itself through traditional (read: r/evolutionary means) or is allowed to fallow until it's no longer plagued by its people.
Last edited by Deacon on Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:31 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Post by Makh » Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:18 pm

Interfering or not, you would still be nosy imperialists. :p

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Re: Zimbabwe to issue Z$100,000,000,000 note

Post by Deacon » Sun Jul 20, 2008 11:32 pm

A refreshing change from Russia, eh? :P
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