WTH is wrong with our economy.

JesseT AzN · Post by **JesseT AzN** » Tue Jul 22, 2003 10:47 pm

Stocks Rise on Earns, Saddam Sons' Deaths

Ok we kill some Saddams sons and the DOW gains 61 points the S&P gains 9 and the Nasdaq gains 24. Does anyone find that slightly disturbing? Does this mean that if we kill Saddam himself the economy will flourish? What about Osama does he contribute to how much money my Lucent stock makes? It went rose like 11cents in one day when this happened. Does killing terrorists boost our economy? That Bush guy must know something....

Edit -- Replaced long URL with something more sane. -- Martin

Lune [6 Option Mod] · Post by **Lune [6 Option Mod]** » Tue Jul 22, 2003 11:01 pm

Gives us more incentive to slaughter them, huh?

A dead terrorist mastermind, former dictator, and the like ... people'd presume that leads to a stabler world. A stabler world means a happier economy.

Post by **Martin Blank** » Tue Jul 22, 2003 11:01 pm

It makes it less likely the war in Iraq will drag on, and that the economy will stabilize with less domestic trouble in the budgets, Iraq's markets opening up, and lower fuel prices potentially on the horizon, which will lower transportation prices and boost consumption.

Talon · Post by **Talon** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 1:21 am

That is kinda ironic... though instead of dead I'd like to see them sent to a jail or something... months of torture by fellow inmates would be a more deserving fate than to simply die... I know that sounds cruel... but after all they did to the iraqi people they deserve it.

~Talon

Post by **Martin Blank** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 1:23 am

The test of a civilized people is how they handle uncivilized people. Punishing people who throw others to the dogs by throwing them to the dogs themselves may feel good, but that does not make it right.

Talon · Post by **Talon** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 1:59 am

The test of a civilized people is how they handle uncivilized people. Punishing people who throw others to the dogs by throwing them to the dogs themselves may feel good, but that does not make it right.

True... but even so... I'd still rather them be given a punishment equal to the pain they've caused.

~Talon

Post by **Martin Blank** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 2:21 am

You can't do it. Physically impossible. Better to put them on trial for crimes against humanity and have them executed.

Mr.Shroom · Post by **Mr.Shroom** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 4:24 am

But again...theres one thing in KNOWING that to be true, and another thing in SEEING that truth through.

Sola · Post by **Sola** » Wed Jul 23, 2003 9:19 am

[quote="Mr.Shroom";p="119645"]But again...theres one thing in KNOWING that to be true, and another thing in SEEING that truth through.[/quote]

Hah hah... That's great. XD

0bb3 · Post by **0bb3** » Sun Jul 27, 2003 9:05 pm

It makes it less likely the war in Iraq will drag on, and that the economy will stabilize with less domestic trouble in the budgets, Iraq's markets opening up, and lower fuel prices potentially on the horizon, which will lower transportation prices and boost consumption.

I thought you said oil had nothing to do with the war? And by the way I have heard that the US will use Iraqi oil to cover the expenses of a war that no one wanted.

Gives us more incentive to slaughter them, huh?

A dead terrorist mastermind, former dictator, and the like ... people'd presume that leads to a stabler world. A stabler world means a happier economy.

Um, I don't really think that many corporations where particulary afraid of investing in other countries except Iraq, the world hasn't actually become more stable since the Baath-regime was removed. I mean it's really the different, nowadays you can't know when the US will go to war.

Post by **Martin Blank** » Mon Jul 28, 2003 12:34 am

[quote="0bb3";p="122717"]I thought you said oil had nothing to do with the war? And by the way I have heard that the US will use Iraqi oil to cover the expenses of a war that no one wanted.[/quote]
I say again to you and all the others railing against the war and not caring a whit about what happened to the thousands of raped and murdered Iraqi people suffering under Saddam's government, yelling that it was to enrich Bush's oil buddies, no, it wasn't. But anyone who thought that the re-emergence of Iraqi oil would not change the markets was a fool. Libya may be only months away from re-entering the world market, and Iran, if the protests continue and the theocracy falls, may also re-enter the world market as a whole, and those will also change things.

I reiterate a point I have made many times before: If it was about oil, even about lowering fuel prices without enriching the oil companies themselves, the embargo would have been lifted years ago. Libya's would have been lifted. Iran's would have been lifted.

At this time, there is little oil leaving Iraq compared to what its potential is. The shipping mechanisms need repair, the pipelines need to be cleaned and repaired, the pumps and drills need to be worked on, and once the whole thing is set up, then the company will decide to whom it sells its oil.

In addition, Iraq is a member of OPEC. OPEC puts out quotas (which are regularly broken by all members, but usually by predictable amounts) by which Iraq may abide, and even if Iraq doesn't, quotas can be imposed on the rest of the nations to restrict their oil output to keep prices at a point that makes the rest of OPEC reasonably happy.

And you haven't learned yet that "I have heard" isn't a valid statement? Provide links or references when you make claims like that.

0bb3 · Post by **0bb3** » Wed Jul 30, 2003 2:32 am

say again to you and all the others railing against the war and not caring a whit about what happened to the thousands of raped and murdered Iraqi people suffering under Saddam's government, yelling that it was to enrich Bush's oil buddies, no, it wasn't. But anyone who thought that the re-emergence of Iraqi oil would not change the markets was a fool. Libya may be only months away from re-entering the world market, and Iran, if the protests continue and the theocracy falls, may also re-enter the world market as a whole, and those will also change things.

First of all you have seemed to have got one thing wrong about the peacemovement. We were aware of Saddams cruel regime, no doubt. And I myself believed that the war would be about oil mainly, but now I have realized that it isn't mainly about oil, that is only a partial bit of the entire war.

And you haven't learned yet that "I have heard" isn't a valid statement? Provide links or references when you make claims like that.

Okay, I'll just go find my bioorganic-network card so I can link to several people holding speeches about international conflicts. I do not generally get information from internet sources, since I am no good at scouring the web for informing, I generally listen to speeches or read magazines or books. Therefore I cannot link to the source.

References (among others):
Mikael von Knorring, member of the Swedish Network Against War.
America Vera Zavala, member of Attac, expert at international affairs and globalization.
Darak Hall, member of the an american socialistic union (do not remember which one)
A pakestanian man, do not remember his name, member of the socialistic party of Pakistan.
Ali Esbati, Chairman (or whatever it's called) of the Young Left in Sweden.

Post by **Martin Blank** » Wed Jul 30, 2003 2:51 am

The problem is that you almost never provide any information about where you got your "news". No links, no titles, no dates of speeches. There are other Swedes here who might be able to translate the information. This time around you've provided names, which is a good step, but still no dates.

Fixer · Post by **Fixer** » Wed Jul 30, 2003 1:04 pm

*ring*

Hello? Mr. von Knorring?
Yes, this is Fixer. Yes, I know my name sounds funny.
I was wondering if you could tell me something about your views on international... yes, I'll hold.
...
...
Yes, Mr von Knorring? Yes sir, I am still here. A person I was talking to over the Internet said that YOU said that... yes, I'll hold.
...
...
...
*click*
Son of a bitch, he hung up on me.

Non-written references are very difficult to confirm, Obb3. Please provide some written references to what you state.

After all, "He said that she said" is nothing more than heresay, and often more like rumor.

0bb3 · Post by **0bb3** » Tue Aug 05, 2003 2:56 pm

*huff* How many times do I have to point it out, I do not scour the internet for information, I get it from articles, books, speeches whatever, and I do not write down every single piece of information I come upon, I store it in my head.
And I know non-written sources are difficult to confirm (since I have to write everything down, tape it or something and let someone else confirm it)... ah well...

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