Whatever the Hell appeals to me when I vote is what I am.
And the two major parties have yet to give me any strong reasoning for me to affiliate with either of them. Nor have any of the smaller parties in U.S. politics.
Good Luck Californa Voters!
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1) Remain civil. Respect others' rights to their viewpoints, even if you believe them to be completely wrong.
2) Sourcing your information is highly recommended. Plagiarism will get you banned.
3) Please create a new thread for a new topic, even if you think it might not get a lot of responses. Do not create mega-threads.
4) If you think the subject of a thread is not important enough to merit a post, simply avoid posting in it. If enough people agree, it will fall off the page soon enough.
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Lune [6 Option Mod]
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StruckingFuggle
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Hm. So basically, you're not an "-ist", because you haven't found an "-ism" that appeals to you and you find yourself agreeing with.
Wow, one wouldn't expect to find us agreeing on anything, would they? But I'd say the same thing - I haven't found a single major or minor party that I would support - i.e. vote for.
Of course, granted, if we found -isms I'm sure they'd be different, but still, it's some sort of agreement.
Wow, one wouldn't expect to find us agreeing on anything, would they? But I'd say the same thing - I haven't found a single major or minor party that I would support - i.e. vote for.
Of course, granted, if we found -isms I'm sure they'd be different, but still, it's some sort of agreement.
"He who lives by the sword dies by my arrow."
"In your histories, there are continual justifications for all manner of hellish actions. Claims of nobility and heritage and honor to cover up every bit of genocide, assassination, and massacre. At least the Horde is honest in their naked lust for power."
"In your histories, there are continual justifications for all manner of hellish actions. Claims of nobility and heritage and honor to cover up every bit of genocide, assassination, and massacre. At least the Horde is honest in their naked lust for power."
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Lune [6 Option Mod]
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The thing is, I'd prefer to stay absolutely independent of any groups, for my sake. It's easier to do so considering the fact that my opinion on issues varies greatly. I prefer pro-birth (republican), but am also pro-gun control (democratic), just as an example of the party line conflict.
Add to that that I am majoring in International Relations (focus on Diplomacy) and minoring in Sociology. With the occupations that come with these focuses of expertise, it'd be in my best interest to stay neutral anyway, you know?
Add to that that I am majoring in International Relations (focus on Diplomacy) and minoring in Sociology. With the occupations that come with these focuses of expertise, it'd be in my best interest to stay neutral anyway, you know?
Back to the topic...I've heard the actual startign petition for the recall was of about in double digit millions. But doesn't that only work out to about 5-10% of overall state voters agreeing to this? Or say, 1-2 out of 5? This seems more like 'doctor-approved' type hype than an actually decisive move.
And isn't it odd that most of the money-grease behind this push for a replacement is almost completly that of a well-off pundit who seems more to want their own private representation on the stage? I mean, sure, I could consent that he's rich and AGREES with the 'cause'...but I'd like to see a wee bit more grass-roots citizen involvement and less suits.
And isn't it odd that most of the money-grease behind this push for a replacement is almost completly that of a well-off pundit who seems more to want their own private representation on the stage? I mean, sure, I could consent that he's rich and AGREES with the 'cause'...but I'd like to see a wee bit more grass-roots citizen involvement and less suits.
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Martin Blank
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About 1.6 million signatures were turned in, and about 1.3 million were certified, far more than the 897,158 signatures required. This is much like a ballot initiative, wherein a certain number of signatures must be collected to qualify it for the ballot, on the idea that it represents a certain portion of the population that would vote on the issue.
The money came mostly from Rep. Darryl Issa, a Republican, and someone who will not be getting my vote mostly because he funded it so he could get on the ballot. Right now, the likely candidates to appear on the ballot are:
The Libertarian, Peace and Freedom, and Naturral Law parties have not announced yet, but they're expected to field candidates as well. I've heard estimates of as many as 30 people on the ballot, since it costs only $3500 and one needs only 65 signatures from one's political party to be certified to be on the ballot. The only constitutional requirements are that the person must be 18 or older, a citizen of the United States, and a resident of California.
The money came mostly from Rep. Darryl Issa, a Republican, and someone who will not be getting my vote mostly because he funded it so he could get on the ballot. Right now, the likely candidates to appear on the ballot are:
- Darryl Issa, Republican, House Representative
- Richard Riordan, Republican, former Los Angeles mayor
- Bill Simon, Republican, businessman and 2002 Republican gubernatorial nominee
- Tom McClintock, Republican, State Senator
- Arnold Schwarzeneggar, Republican, actor and businessman
- Peter Camejo, Green, investment advisor
- Ron Gulke, American Independent, businessman
The Libertarian, Peace and Freedom, and Naturral Law parties have not announced yet, but they're expected to field candidates as well. I've heard estimates of as many as 30 people on the ballot, since it costs only $3500 and one needs only 65 signatures from one's political party to be certified to be on the ballot. The only constitutional requirements are that the person must be 18 or older, a citizen of the United States, and a resident of California.
If I show up at your door, chances are you did something to bring me there.
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Lune [6 Option Mod]
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The more I read this the more excited I get.-
Martin Blank
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StruckingFuggle
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- Location: Austin / San Marcos, Tx
[quote="Martin Blank";p="121480"]I've heard estimates of as many as 30 people on the ballot, since it costs only $3500 and one needs only 65 signatures from one's political party to be certified to be on the ballot[/quote]
So you can't run if you don't belong to a political party?
(and, the Democrats keeping anyone but Davis from running has to be one of the single dumbest ideas, EVER. Can you really be THAT politically BLIND?)
So you can't run if you don't belong to a political party?
(and, the Democrats keeping anyone but Davis from running has to be one of the single dumbest ideas, EVER. Can you really be THAT politically BLIND?)
"He who lives by the sword dies by my arrow."
"In your histories, there are continual justifications for all manner of hellish actions. Claims of nobility and heritage and honor to cover up every bit of genocide, assassination, and massacre. At least the Horde is honest in their naked lust for power."
"In your histories, there are continual justifications for all manner of hellish actions. Claims of nobility and heritage and honor to cover up every bit of genocide, assassination, and massacre. At least the Horde is honest in their naked lust for power."
-
Lune [6 Option Mod]
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Beware of the Leopard
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In other words... no, you can't 
And, Strucking, from what you said, you are somewhere in the liberal spectrum. I wouldn't say that assigns you to a particular party, because sometime particular issues weigh more heavily than others. I always wonder how many Republicans would cross over to the Democratic party if the gun issue was officially dropped from consideration. Though, it could be the same as the Democrats switching over who were only in that party for gun control. *shrugs*
What was the statement that got him into trouble? I wonder if Florida could recall Jeb for his "devious plans" for education slip. We probably don't have that option, though.
And, Strucking, from what you said, you are somewhere in the liberal spectrum. I wouldn't say that assigns you to a particular party, because sometime particular issues weigh more heavily than others. I always wonder how many Republicans would cross over to the Democratic party if the gun issue was officially dropped from consideration. Though, it could be the same as the Democrats switching over who were only in that party for gun control. *shrugs*
What was the statement that got him into trouble? I wonder if Florida could recall Jeb for his "devious plans" for education slip. We probably don't have that option, though.
"I think all right-thinking people in this country are sick and tired of being told that ordinary decent people are fed up in this country with being sick and tired. I'm certainly not, and I'm sick and tired of being told that I am."
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Martin Blank
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That got Gray Davis in trouble? It wasn't a single statement, but instead his overall performance. He knew he would lose to Richard Riordan, so he spent $10M during the primaries to make Riordan look bad so Republicans would vote for Simon. Voting with a major choice between Davis and Simon was akin to voting on whether you wanted to die by being bled to death or being bludgeoned to death, awake the whole time.
The main issues that have come up with Davis are:
The main issues that have come up with Davis are:
- The state's budget deficit -- Reported by Davis just before the election last year to be $10B (an annoying amount, but able to be handled with some cuts and a couple of small tax increases) to $38B -- more than the entire budgets of most states. Compare this to a budget surplus of $4.4B in 1998.
- The size of the state budget (keep this in the perspective of a 1989-90 budget of about $49B, and a 1998-99 budget of about $74B):
- 1999-2000: $81,347,021,685
- 2000-2001: $99,424,137,212
- 2001-2002: $103,279,391,394
- 2002-2003: $98,887,862,521
- Handling of the state electricity crisis -- When the various companies were cheating the state system for sharp increases like a crappy CS player looking for OpenGL hacks, Davis panicked and signed more than 40 secret 10-year deals totalling $43B in electricity purchases by the state for distribution through the electric companies. This has been estimated to be more than twice the fair market values of the electricity.
- Adding 40,000 employees to the state personnel rolls since taking office -- the state had more than 200,000 employees at that time.
- Taking money from just about anyone -- he has hired cronies and donors to $300,000 per year positions in exchange for political help or donations. The state prison guard union, his biggest source of campaign funds, has consistently gotten huge budget increases every year.
If I show up at your door, chances are you did something to bring me there.
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cephas47
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I'm not a California resident; I'm a Louisiana resident. To all this I have three letters:
EWE
(Edwin Edwards, former governor, who, not 8 months into his 10 year sentence for racketeering, is already fielding a petition to get his federal sentence commuted)
Heck, if I were Californian, I would say "Greg Dean for governor!"
I mean, who isn't running?
Or was it Tony that paid the $3500 to get his name on the ballot?
(Yeah, I'm brushing this whole bit off, but I wanted to throw "Greg Dean for governor!" in there somewhere, if only to elicit a response from ye forum god.)
EWE
(Edwin Edwards, former governor, who, not 8 months into his 10 year sentence for racketeering, is already fielding a petition to get his federal sentence commuted)
Heck, if I were Californian, I would say "Greg Dean for governor!"
I mean, who isn't running?
Or was it Tony that paid the $3500 to get his name on the ballot?
(Yeah, I'm brushing this whole bit off, but I wanted to throw "Greg Dean for governor!" in there somewhere, if only to elicit a response from ye forum god.)
"...when all is said and all has come undone
restore the promise I made when I was young
now unto Him who can keep us from falling and
present us faultless before His glory...."
-Newsboys, breathe [benediction]
restore the promise I made when I was young
now unto Him who can keep us from falling and
present us faultless before His glory...."
-Newsboys, breathe [benediction]
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Martin Blank
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- Contact:
Approved candidates
This is not the order in which they will appear on the ballot.
Iris Adam, Natural Law, Irvine
Brooke Adams, nonpartisan, Dana Point
Douglas Anderson, Republican, Moorpark
Angelyne, nonpartisan, Beverly Hills
Mohammad Arif, nonpartisan, Culver City
Badi Badiozamani, nonpartisan, San Diego
Vik S. Bajwa, Democrat, Santa Rosa
John W. Beard, Republican, North Hollywood
Ed Beyer, Republican, San Clemente
Vip Bhola, Republican, North Hollywood
Cheryl Bly-Chester, Republican, Roseville
Audie Bock, Democrat, Oakland
Joel Britton, nonpartisan, Los Angeles
Art Brown, Democrat, Canoga Park
John Christopher Burton, nonpartisan, Pasadena
Cruz M. Bustamante, Democrat, Sacramento
Peter Miguel Camejo, Green, Oakland
Todd Carson, Republican, Costa Mesa
"William ""Bill"" S. Chambers", Republican, Auburn
Michael Cheli, nonpartisan, Santa Rosa
D. (Logan Darrow) Clements, Republican, Pacific Palisades
Gary Coleman, nonpartisan, Beverly Hills
"Mary ""Mary Carey"" Cook", nonpartisan, Los Angeles
Robert Cullenbine, Democrat, Palo Alto
Scott Davis, nonpartisan, Palo Alto
"Robert ""Butch"" Dole", Republican, Milpitas
Bob Lynn Edwards, Democrat, Fremont
Warren Farrell, Democrat, Carlsbad
Dan Feinstein, Democrat, San Francisco
Larry Flynt, Democrat, Beverly Hills
Lorraine (Abner Zurd) Fontanes, Democrat, Los Angeles
Gene Forte, Republican, Carmel
Diana Foss, Democrat, San Jose
Ronald J. Friedman, nonpartisan, Woodland Hills
Leo Gallagher, nonpartisan, Agoura Hills
Gerold Lee Gorman, Democrat, Martinez
Rich Gosse, Republican, San Rafael
James H. Green, Democrat, San Francisco
Jack Loyd Grisham, nonpartisan, Los Angeles
Garrett Gruener, Democrat, San Francisco
Joe Guzzardi, Democrat, Lodi
Ivan A. Hall, Green, Redding
Ken Hamidi, Libertarian, Citrus Heights
Sara Ann Hanlon, nonpartisan, La Mirada
C. Stephen Henderson, nonpartisan, Carmel Valley
Ralph A. Hernandez, Democrat, Antioch
"John J. ""Jack"" Hickey", Libertarian, Emerald Hills
Jim Hoffmann, Republican, Manteca
Arianna Huffington, nonpartisan, Santa Monica
S. Issa, Republican, Arcadia
Michael Jackson, Republican, Long Beach
Trek Thunder Kelly, nonpartisan, Venice
"Edward ""Ed"" Kennedy", Democrat, Weaverville
D.E. Kessinger, Democrat, Riverside
Kelly P. Kimball, Democrat, Calabasas
Stephen L. Knapp, Republican, Los Gatos
Eric Korevaar, Democrat, La Jolla
Jerry Kunzman, nonpartisan, Richmond
Dick Lane, Democrat, Sunnyvale
Gary Leonard, Democrat, Los Angeles
Todd Richard Lewis, nonpartisan, West Hollywood
Calvin Y. Louie, Democrat, San Francisco
Frank A. Macaluso Jr., Democrat, Visalia
"Paul ""Chip"" Mailander", Democrat, Rancho Santa Fe
Robert C. Mannheim, Democrat, Agoura Hills
Bruce Margolin, Democrat, West Hollywood
Paul Mariano, Democrat, Martinez
Gino Martorana, Republican, Kingsburg
Mike P. McCarthy, nonpartisan, San Luis Obispo
Bob McClain, nonpartisan, Oakland
Tom McClintock, Republican, Sacramento
Dennis Duggan McMahon, Republican, San Francisco
Mike McNeilly, Republican, Beverly Hills
Scott A. Mednick, Democrat, Calabasas
Carl A. Mehr, Republican, San Diego
Jonathan Miller, Democrat, Newark
Darryl L. Mobley, nonpartisan, Danville
Jeffrey L. Mock, Republican, Compton
"John ""Jack"" Mortensen", Democrat, Folsom
Dorene Musilli, Republican, Boyes Hot Springs
Paul Nave, Democrat, San Anselmo
Robert C. Newman II, Republican, Redlands
Leonard Padilla, nonpartisan, Sacramento
Ronald Jason Palmieri, Democrat, Los Angeles
Gregory J. Pawlik, Republican, Pacific Palisades
Heather Peters, Republican, Santa Monica
"Charles ""Chuck"" Pineda Jr.", Democrat, Sacramento
Bill Prady, Democrat, Studio City
Darin Price, Natural Law, McKinleyville
Bryan Quinn, Republican, San Jose
Jeff Rainforth, nonpartisan, Sacramento
"Daniel C. ""Danny"" Ramirez", Democrat, Calexico
Christopher Ranken, Democrat, Pacifica
Reva Renee Renz, Republican, Tustin
Daniel W. Richards, Republican, Rancho Cucamonga
Kevin Richter, Republican, Manteca
"Kurt E. ""Tachikaze"" Rightmyer", nonpartisan, West Covina
David Laughing Horse Robinson, Democrat, Bakersfield
Ned Roscoe, Libertarian, Benicia
Sharon Rushford, nonpartisan, Santa Clara
Georgy Russell, Democrat, Mountain View
Jamie Rosemary Safford, Republican, Granite Bay
David Ronald Sams, Republican, Agoura Hills
Darrin H. Scheidle, Democrat, El Cajon
Mike Schmier, Democrat, Emeryville
George B. Schwartzman, nonpartisan, Carlsbad
Arnold Schwarzenegger, Republican, Santa Monica
Richard J. Simmons, nonpartisan, Los Angeles
Bill Simon Jr., Republican, Sacramento
B.E. Smith, nonpartisan, Denny
Randall D. Sprague, Republican, Elk Grove
Christopher Sproul, Democrat, San Francisco
Alex St. James, Republican, Sacramento
Lawrence Steven Strauss, Democrat, Studio City
Tim Sylvester, Democrat, Sonora
A. Lavar Taylor, Democrat, Santa Ana
Diane Beall Templin, American Independent, Escondido
Patricia G. Tilley, nonpartisan, Sacramento
Brian Tracy, nonpartisan, Solana Beach
William Tsangares, Republican, Los Angeles
Peter V. Ueberroth, Republican, Newport Beach
Marc Valdez, Democrat, Sacramento
James M. Vandeventer Jr., Republican, Los Angeles
Paul W. Vann, Republican, Irvine
Bill Vaughn, Democrat, Lafayette
Van Vo, Republican, Garden Grove
Chuck Walker, Republican, Scotts Valley
Maurice Walker, Green, San Leandro
Nathan Whitecloud Walton, nonpartisan, San Diego
Daniel Watts, Green, San Jose
C.T. Weber, Peace and Freedom, Sacramento
Jim Weir, Democrat, Grass Valley
Lingel H. Winters, Democrat, San Francisco
Michael J. Wozniak, Democrat, Oakland
John W. Zellhoefer, Republican, Tecopa
Iris Adam, Natural Law, Irvine
Brooke Adams, nonpartisan, Dana Point
Douglas Anderson, Republican, Moorpark
Angelyne, nonpartisan, Beverly Hills
Mohammad Arif, nonpartisan, Culver City
Badi Badiozamani, nonpartisan, San Diego
Vik S. Bajwa, Democrat, Santa Rosa
John W. Beard, Republican, North Hollywood
Ed Beyer, Republican, San Clemente
Vip Bhola, Republican, North Hollywood
Cheryl Bly-Chester, Republican, Roseville
Audie Bock, Democrat, Oakland
Joel Britton, nonpartisan, Los Angeles
Art Brown, Democrat, Canoga Park
John Christopher Burton, nonpartisan, Pasadena
Cruz M. Bustamante, Democrat, Sacramento
Peter Miguel Camejo, Green, Oakland
Todd Carson, Republican, Costa Mesa
"William ""Bill"" S. Chambers", Republican, Auburn
Michael Cheli, nonpartisan, Santa Rosa
D. (Logan Darrow) Clements, Republican, Pacific Palisades
Gary Coleman, nonpartisan, Beverly Hills
"Mary ""Mary Carey"" Cook", nonpartisan, Los Angeles
Robert Cullenbine, Democrat, Palo Alto
Scott Davis, nonpartisan, Palo Alto
"Robert ""Butch"" Dole", Republican, Milpitas
Bob Lynn Edwards, Democrat, Fremont
Warren Farrell, Democrat, Carlsbad
Dan Feinstein, Democrat, San Francisco
Larry Flynt, Democrat, Beverly Hills
Lorraine (Abner Zurd) Fontanes, Democrat, Los Angeles
Gene Forte, Republican, Carmel
Diana Foss, Democrat, San Jose
Ronald J. Friedman, nonpartisan, Woodland Hills
Leo Gallagher, nonpartisan, Agoura Hills
Gerold Lee Gorman, Democrat, Martinez
Rich Gosse, Republican, San Rafael
James H. Green, Democrat, San Francisco
Jack Loyd Grisham, nonpartisan, Los Angeles
Garrett Gruener, Democrat, San Francisco
Joe Guzzardi, Democrat, Lodi
Ivan A. Hall, Green, Redding
Ken Hamidi, Libertarian, Citrus Heights
Sara Ann Hanlon, nonpartisan, La Mirada
C. Stephen Henderson, nonpartisan, Carmel Valley
Ralph A. Hernandez, Democrat, Antioch
"John J. ""Jack"" Hickey", Libertarian, Emerald Hills
Jim Hoffmann, Republican, Manteca
Arianna Huffington, nonpartisan, Santa Monica
S. Issa, Republican, Arcadia
Michael Jackson, Republican, Long Beach
Trek Thunder Kelly, nonpartisan, Venice
"Edward ""Ed"" Kennedy", Democrat, Weaverville
D.E. Kessinger, Democrat, Riverside
Kelly P. Kimball, Democrat, Calabasas
Stephen L. Knapp, Republican, Los Gatos
Eric Korevaar, Democrat, La Jolla
Jerry Kunzman, nonpartisan, Richmond
Dick Lane, Democrat, Sunnyvale
Gary Leonard, Democrat, Los Angeles
Todd Richard Lewis, nonpartisan, West Hollywood
Calvin Y. Louie, Democrat, San Francisco
Frank A. Macaluso Jr., Democrat, Visalia
"Paul ""Chip"" Mailander", Democrat, Rancho Santa Fe
Robert C. Mannheim, Democrat, Agoura Hills
Bruce Margolin, Democrat, West Hollywood
Paul Mariano, Democrat, Martinez
Gino Martorana, Republican, Kingsburg
Mike P. McCarthy, nonpartisan, San Luis Obispo
Bob McClain, nonpartisan, Oakland
Tom McClintock, Republican, Sacramento
Dennis Duggan McMahon, Republican, San Francisco
Mike McNeilly, Republican, Beverly Hills
Scott A. Mednick, Democrat, Calabasas
Carl A. Mehr, Republican, San Diego
Jonathan Miller, Democrat, Newark
Darryl L. Mobley, nonpartisan, Danville
Jeffrey L. Mock, Republican, Compton
"John ""Jack"" Mortensen", Democrat, Folsom
Dorene Musilli, Republican, Boyes Hot Springs
Paul Nave, Democrat, San Anselmo
Robert C. Newman II, Republican, Redlands
Leonard Padilla, nonpartisan, Sacramento
Ronald Jason Palmieri, Democrat, Los Angeles
Gregory J. Pawlik, Republican, Pacific Palisades
Heather Peters, Republican, Santa Monica
"Charles ""Chuck"" Pineda Jr.", Democrat, Sacramento
Bill Prady, Democrat, Studio City
Darin Price, Natural Law, McKinleyville
Bryan Quinn, Republican, San Jose
Jeff Rainforth, nonpartisan, Sacramento
"Daniel C. ""Danny"" Ramirez", Democrat, Calexico
Christopher Ranken, Democrat, Pacifica
Reva Renee Renz, Republican, Tustin
Daniel W. Richards, Republican, Rancho Cucamonga
Kevin Richter, Republican, Manteca
"Kurt E. ""Tachikaze"" Rightmyer", nonpartisan, West Covina
David Laughing Horse Robinson, Democrat, Bakersfield
Ned Roscoe, Libertarian, Benicia
Sharon Rushford, nonpartisan, Santa Clara
Georgy Russell, Democrat, Mountain View
Jamie Rosemary Safford, Republican, Granite Bay
David Ronald Sams, Republican, Agoura Hills
Darrin H. Scheidle, Democrat, El Cajon
Mike Schmier, Democrat, Emeryville
George B. Schwartzman, nonpartisan, Carlsbad
Arnold Schwarzenegger, Republican, Santa Monica
Richard J. Simmons, nonpartisan, Los Angeles
Bill Simon Jr., Republican, Sacramento
B.E. Smith, nonpartisan, Denny
Randall D. Sprague, Republican, Elk Grove
Christopher Sproul, Democrat, San Francisco
Alex St. James, Republican, Sacramento
Lawrence Steven Strauss, Democrat, Studio City
Tim Sylvester, Democrat, Sonora
A. Lavar Taylor, Democrat, Santa Ana
Diane Beall Templin, American Independent, Escondido
Patricia G. Tilley, nonpartisan, Sacramento
Brian Tracy, nonpartisan, Solana Beach
William Tsangares, Republican, Los Angeles
Peter V. Ueberroth, Republican, Newport Beach
Marc Valdez, Democrat, Sacramento
James M. Vandeventer Jr., Republican, Los Angeles
Paul W. Vann, Republican, Irvine
Bill Vaughn, Democrat, Lafayette
Van Vo, Republican, Garden Grove
Chuck Walker, Republican, Scotts Valley
Maurice Walker, Green, San Leandro
Nathan Whitecloud Walton, nonpartisan, San Diego
Daniel Watts, Green, San Jose
C.T. Weber, Peace and Freedom, Sacramento
Jim Weir, Democrat, Grass Valley
Lingel H. Winters, Democrat, San Francisco
Michael J. Wozniak, Democrat, Oakland
John W. Zellhoefer, Republican, Tecopa
If I show up at your door, chances are you did something to bring me there.
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Eihger
- Redshirt
- Posts: 6020
- Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2003 1:25 pm
- Gender: Male
- Location: That bowl of heat Arizona
socalism- belife that the government should control all
"Water is fluid, soft, and yielding. But water will wear away rock which is rigid and cannot yield. As a rule, whatever is fluid, soft, and yielding will overcome whatever is rigid and hard. This is another paradox: whatever is soft is strong."
~Lao Tzu
People are catastrophically stupid; persons are intriguingly smart
My DoW2 Mod Men of the 89th
~Lao Tzu
People are catastrophically stupid; persons are intriguingly smart
My DoW2 Mod Men of the 89th
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