That damn word

Quietus · Post by **Quietus** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 11:41 pm

Alright, I'm sure to draw a lot of fire for this, but I have to say it.

Lately, I've been hearing a lot of "That's our word!" referring, of course, to n*****. This just pisses me off for a variety of reasons, which I shall list now.

1. You can't own a word any more than I "own" the golf clubs they loan out to me when I go miniature golfing.

2. N***** predates African slavery. It just pisses me off that people are just that ignorant. The term itself was used to denote any person that worked heavy labor, and neither refered to race or slavery. Hell, most indentured servants were called n*****s.

3. This self-rightous bullcrap is usually peddled with other self-rightous bullcrap, like saying that the term 'crowbar' is racist (yet another one that predates african slavery).

Anyways, people just piss me off in general. Troll away.

SothThe69th · Post by **SothThe69th** » Mon Sep 29, 2003 11:44 pm

Its nigger. Just say it. Jesus. Who in the hell is going to get angry at you for saying nigger in a rant about the word itself?

Post by **Martin Blank** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 12:37 am

[quote="Quietus";p="169627"]2. N***** predates African slavery. It just pisses me off that people are just that ignorant. The term itself was used to denote any person that worked heavy labor, and neither refered to race or slavery. Hell, most indentured servants were called n*****s.[/quote]
Source: From Alteration of dialectal neger, black person, from French nègre, from Spanish negro.

That's according to The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition.

Quietus · Post by **Quietus** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 12:51 am

That's according to The American Heritage® Dictionary of the English Language, Fourth Edition.

Languages change, my friend. I'm just pointing out that it's not an original word expressly made for them. The word was there long before they were, so they cannot apply for ownership. If it belongs to anybody, it belongs to serfs.

Quietus · Post by **Quietus** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 12:56 am

Its nigger. Just say it. Jesus. Who in the hell is going to get angry at you for saying nigger in a rant about the word itself?

The same people who think white people shouldn't be saying it. I'm just covering my bases

gravity · Post by **gravity** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 1:08 am

It may not have been derogatory before, but it is a derogatory term now.

Like the word bitch.

It used to mean only a female breeding dog, but now it means so much worse.

Just don't use either term, unless you're specifically around company who you know for a fact won't be offended, and knows you don't mean it in a rude, derogatory way, and be nice.

Neither term is nice, and neither term should ever be used.

Killer-Rabbit · Post by **Killer-Rabbit** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 1:08 am

[quote="Quietus";p="169661"]

Its nigger. Just say it. Jesus. Who in the hell is going to get angry at you for saying nigger in a rant about the word itself?

The same people who think white people shouldn't be saying it. I'm just covering my bases[/quote]

Well if they think that white people cant say it and they can, they are being racist...

SothThe69th · Post by **SothThe69th** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 1:16 am

Quietus, foolish mortal, wrote:
Its nigger. Just say it. Jesus. Who in the hell is going to get angry at you for saying nigger in a rant about the word itself?
The same people who think white people shouldn't be saying it. I'm just covering my bases

Notice the quantifier? "In a rant about the word itself". Its like if I was ranting about the word Bitch. If a person gets offended that I would say the word bitch in a rant ABOUT the word bitch, then that reflects a problem with them, not with me.

Quietus · Post by **Quietus** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 1:35 am

to sum it up: people suck.

Post by **Martin Blank** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 1:54 am

[quote="Quietus";p="169657"]Languages change, my friend. I'm just pointing out that it's not an original word expressly made for them. The word was there long before they were, so they cannot apply for ownership. If it belongs to anybody, it belongs to serfs.[/quote]
I beg to differ. A number of sites dedicated to word origins cite it as derived from the Latin word for "black". WordOrigins.org has this entry in part:

This most offensive of words in American speech dates back to the late 16th century, although the modern spelling doesn't appear until two centuries later. The OED2's earliest cite of the modern spelling is from 1786 in Burns's Ordination. (The Random House Historical Dictionary of American Slang, however, claims that this is an editorial error and Burns's original manuscript uses the older niger.) The obsolete spelling niger dates to 1574. It comes from the Latin meaning black. It shares this common root with negro.

The offensiveness of the term has increased over time, especially in the 20th century. Two 16th century quotes that are commonly cited in dictionaries are from scholarly tracts. A 1700 quote by judge Samuel Sewall uses the term in a denunciation of slavery. Gradually, however, polite discourse increasingly used the term negro (which dates to at least 1555) and nigger became relegated to the vulgar tongue, increasing in offensiveness over the centuries.

It seems it's always been used to refer to black people, first factually and slowly in a derogatory sense.

Quietus · Post by **Quietus** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:22 am

It seems it's always been used to refer to black people, first factually and slowly in a derogatory sense.

well, if that's what you've found, that's fine. what I've learned concerned colonial times and I learned from teachers. you could easily be right about the origins, and my teachers who spent years studying the subject may be wrong.

anyways, I still believe they care far too much about it.

Shyknight · Post by **Shyknight** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 3:36 am

I don't think ANYONE should use that word anymore. I think they should kill it dead. Not even black people should want to use it. It should be abandoned as a way of putting such horrible racism and inequality behind us forever. I've never used it, and I'm appalled when others do, even if they are black.

ChronoSword · Post by **ChronoSword** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 4:36 am

[quote="Shyknight";p="169836"]I don't think ANYONE should use that word anymore. I think they should kill it dead. Not even black people should want to use it. It should be abandoned as a way of putting such horrible racism and inequality behind us forever. I've never used it, and I'm appalled when others do, even if they are black.[/quote]

That might happen in an ideal world, but i don't think it is possible at least anytime soon. It might happen in the long term through the evolution of the English language by phasing the word out like many other words have been, but that is completely random (could be chaotic).

Post by **Blaze** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 5:53 am

Actually... I have a bit of a peeve on this word myself right now.

My uncle was recently fired from Ford Wixom plant. He works as a welder there, which means he gets called into emergency jobs. Repairing machines and what not when they break. Therefore, he has to wear a radio at all times so they can call him when needed.

He was standing around complaining about somebody, and he happened to say nigger, which was VERY dissapointing. I would expect better from him. At any rate, he had accidentally left his radio microphone on when he did so... and it went out over the air in the plant, and he got fired. Zero tolerance.

So yes, the word is just best avoided.

Fixer · Post by **Fixer** » Tue Sep 30, 2003 1:21 pm

I tend not to say it simply because there are other words to more accurately reflect how I am feeling. If I am referring to someone who is "black" then I say "black" (or, as my son has said: 'why are you brown?'). If I am referring to someone who has ticked me off, and happens to be black, I call them an "asshole". Frankly, I believe assholes exist in all shapes and colors, so I just call it like it is. If I am referring to someone who is black and is being lazy, I call them "lazy" or "move your ass", depending on whether or not they are in my way. To be quite frank, I do not care what a person's color is, I just call it like I see it without any racial qualifiers unless I am directly speaking about their skin color or ethnic background.

Same thing goes for cubans, chinese, korean, mexicans, native americans, east indians, muslums, british, italians, japanese, etc. If they get offended, it is them being hypersensitive, not me uttering racial slurs.

If they try to make something racial about it, tell them they can fuck off. Usually this either provokes them into a fight or they get so frustrated you can hear them 'pop' and then walk away. Either way, problem solved.

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