Religions (I do need this info (Statistics))

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What is your religion?

Christian
59
28%
Catholic
12
6%
Buddhism
3
1%
Islam
5
2%
Judaism
5
2%
Wicca
9
4%
Atheist
52
24%
Agnostic
31
15%
Hindu
1
0%
Other (Please Specify)
36
17%
 
Total votes: 213

Devi-Chan
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Re: Religions (I do need this info (Statistics))

Post by Devi-Chan » Wed Feb 11, 2004 6:46 pm

Wiccan...syncretic Wiccan, which is not the same as white-light-fluffy-bunny Wiccan. ;) Nor still is it the same as trendiWiccan. I've been a practicing Wiccan over half my life at this point and I'm raising my daughter to at least consider it...I think the trend's worn off. ;)

Posted Wed Feb 11, 2004 6:48 pm:

[quote="afkaos";p="246812"]

And Yes, I do need this info for a Statistics project

[/quote]

So...it's a couple months down the line. :) How did the project go?

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Oh, boy...

Post by HomerNet » Fri Feb 13, 2004 9:57 pm

It occurs to me that this thread could well be called Flamewars II: The Return of Arsonist. This is one of those topics that you just don't discuss to keep things polite. However, this forum has never been about following societies rules, so...

Here's how the breakdown should work for the poll choices:

Abrahamic religions
.|- Judaism (all sects)
.|- Islam (all tribes)
.\- Christianity
..|-Catholisism
..|-Protistant (Including all offshoots, such as Baptist, Luthran, etc.)
..\- Mormonism (a.k.a. - The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints (LDS))
....\-"Fundamentalist Mormons" (Breakaway sects from the LDS church)
Ancient European religions
.|- Druidic (all groups)
.|- Old Wiccan
.|- Other Wiccan (modern groups)
.\- (Others I'm sure I'm forgetting)
Tribal religions (Native American, tribal African, etc.)
Eastern
.|- Buddism
.|- Shinto
.|- Hindu
.\(Others I'm forgetting or don't know about)
Non-religious a.k.a. -- Humanist
.|- Atheist (There is no God)
.|- Agnostic (Maybe there is, maybe not)
.\- Non-theist (Who cares?)
Other

Of course, in spite of how complete I tried to make that list, I know I left some out on accident. A complete list would probably stretch for several dozen printed pages.

And now, HomerNet's guide to classifying religions
Find the core of that religion. Whatever that core is, that's how you classify it.

For example, if it's a Christian religion:
Fluff <-The culture of a religion
Stuff <-Commandments, edicts, and scriptures
Christ <-Acknowledging Christ's divinity
God <-The one supreme being to worship
Note to the nitpickers: Whether you believe that Christ and God are the same being or not, what separates Christianity from Judaism and Islam (who worship the same God) is the acknowledgement of Christ's divinity, so putting that "Christ" in as a separate concept is necessary for the present discussion.

For another example, Judaism and Islam:
Fluff <-The culture of a religion-> Fluff
Stuff <-Commandments, edicts, and scriptures-> Stuff
Isaac <-Inheritor of the Abrahamic covenant-> Ishmael
God (Jehova) <--The one supreme being to worship--> God (Alah)
Note: Apologies if I misspelled or gave the wrong name to something, this is not a topic I indulge in enough to know details off the top of my head, which is how I'm writing this.

Christians (which includes Mormons and Catholics) can bicker about what makes a "true Christian" all they want, but if they put their heads up long enough to look around at the other religions, they would notice that all the other religions bicker just as much about what makes a "true <insert religion name here>".

Missused words
Many people confuse polytheism with pantheism, that is, the idea that the acknowledgement of multiple gods automatically presumes the worship of multiple gods.

Japan could be concidered pantheistic, as they believe in a god (kami) for just about everything. (They also practice ancestor worship, which is neither here nor there)

Polytheism is merely an acknowledgement of the existance of other gods. You might accurately say that Mormons are polytheists, but they only worship a single God. I forget the scripture reference, but one of the Ten Commandments is "Thou shalt have no other gods before Me," (someone else can check my accuracy on that) sort of a roundabout admission in the concept of other gods.

To clarify the Mormon position:

You --> Christ --> God
^----Holy Ghost----+

You, the person worshiping God, does so in the name of Jesus Christ, and God answers with the Holy Ghost. Take out the Holy Ghost, God can't talk back without direct communication (another topic entirely), without Christ, we can't return to God. The fulcrum (if you will) is God. Mormons only worship one God, but acknowledge the divinity of all three.

In contrast, the Catholic position:

You --> Saints --> God/Christ/Holy Ghost
^---Pope and priesthood---+

And Protistant (including all the other sects):

You --> God/Christ/Holy Ghost
^---------?--------+

What the question mark represents depends on the sect.

Re: Gouf_Custom's comment; "Mormonism is definitely NOT accepted by the Christian church."
WHICH ONE?!?!?! Many Christians seem to be under the impression that there are two sides in this debate, Mormons vs. Everyone Else. The fact of the matter is that none of the Christian sects can agree on any two points. Either there's music in the chapel or there isn't. Either baptism is necessary or it isn't. Either works are necessary or the aren't. There is no unity! And the Catholics say ALL of them are wrong. You can say your church doesn't accept Mormonism as Christian, but you can't speak for all Christian sects until they can all agree.

Which is about as likely to happen as Osama bin Laden giving a big ol' hug to President Bush without a bomb strapped to his chest or a knife in his hand.

Oh, and yes, I am a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints. REPRESENT!

:twisted:
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Post by Zaph » Fri Feb 13, 2004 10:04 pm

I voted other because my beliefe structure takes a bit from everything.

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Post by Devi-Chan » Fri Feb 13, 2004 10:49 pm

Homer, great post. :) Very nice analogy. Yes, I think you left some things out (Baha'i, for instance, which is a sort of Muslim splinter group and persecuted by certain Muslims about like the Mormons are persecuted by certain Christians), but you're right. It would take forever to list them all.

http://www.religioustolerance.org is a great site for lots of info about, well, just about everyone. :)

I would like to point out that, depending on who you talk to, some modern pagans go by NeoPagan as a way of acknowledging that we honestly don't know what ancient Euro religions were like in some areas, and therefore we're creating our own beliefs. Candidly, though I call myself Wiccan, I'm not at all sure I can trace my religious ancestry to Old Europe. So there's room for argument there, too... and it happens *all the time.*

Once again, great post. :)

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Post by ChronoSword » Fri Feb 13, 2004 11:43 pm

Re: Gouf_Custom's comment; "Mormonism is definitely NOT accepted by the Christian church."
WHICH ONE?!?!?! Many Christians seem to be under the impression that there are two sides in this debate, Mormons vs. Everyone Else. The fact of the matter is that none of the Christian sects can agree on any two points. Either there's music in the chapel or there isn't. Either baptism is necessary or it isn't. Either works are necessary or the aren't. There is no unity! And the Catholics say ALL of them are wrong. You can say your church doesn't accept Mormonism as Christian, but you can't speak for all Christian sects until they can all agree.
There are many doctrinal points that debated between the Christian sects. All true Christians have the same core (Christ came and died for our sins and he is God, not that Jesus, God the father, and the Holy spirit are three separate gods. And that if we have faith in him we will be justified by that faith.) Those other things are just icing on the cake.

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Post by HomerNet » Sat Feb 14, 2004 4:56 am

[quote="ChronoSword";p="278753"]There are many doctrinal points that debated between the Christian sects. All true Christians have the same core (Christ came and died for our sins and he is God, not that Jesus, God the father, and the Holy spirit are three separate gods. And that if we have faith in him we will be justified by that faith.) Those other things are just icing on the cake.[/quote]

There's only one difference between Mormonism and what you typed; Whether God the Father, Jesus Christ, and the Holy Ghost are one or three. For further reading, I might suggest John 17:20-23. Following the doctrine of "One God/Three aspects," one gets, from these scriptures, an image of Christ's disciples doing strange and humorous things in a desperate attempt to "be one."

This, however, is beside the point. Referring back to my original classifier of religions:

Fluff <-The culture of a religion
Stuff <-Commandments, edicts, and scriptures
Christ <-Acknowledging Christ's divinity
God <-The one supreme being to worship

Mormonism has different "fluff" from other Christian religions, we have (some) different "Stuff" from other Christian religions, but check the last two steps; we still acknowledge Christ as our savior, and we still worship the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.
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Post by ChronoSword » Sat Feb 14, 2004 5:40 am

I do agree that both acknowledge Christ as savior and worship the God of Abraham. But, Jews and Muslims also worship the God of Abraham, so just because they worship the "same God", it does not mean that can be the same religion. (in reference to mormonism be Christian)

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Post by HomerNet » Sat Feb 14, 2004 6:01 pm

Yes, but the thing is, Christ is the defining difference between Mormonism and Judaism. We follow Christ, therefor, we are Christians.
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Post by ChronoSword » Sat Feb 14, 2004 6:05 pm

[quote="HomerNet";p="279299"]Yes, but the thing is, Christ is the defining difference between Mormonism and Judaism. We follow Christ, therefor, we are Christians.[/quote]

That is a point we can argue, but nothing good will come of it.

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Post by HomerNet » Sat Feb 14, 2004 6:21 pm

True 'nuff. Agree to disagree?
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Re: Religions (I do need this info (Statistics))

Post by Makh » Sun Feb 15, 2004 8:17 pm

No religion for me thank you.

I do not believe in God. Gods were created by men to explain some events they do not understand. I do not want to criticize those who have a religion but my personal opinion is that religion does not allow men to accomplish themselves. Religion was created because men need to believe something. It gives them a goal, or a justification to live. I think men consider religion as a safety, something that allow them to avoid to search the truth, something like a solace.

Beliefs in God (or Gods) were killed by many events during history. Killed by other religions, killed by science demonstration or killed by idealogies like communism. I said ``beliefs in God`` and not only God. (God can not be killed because he has never existed, you can only renounce to the belief).

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Post by MasteR » Sun Feb 15, 2004 8:21 pm

Other:

Don't give a shit if there is a god, don't give a shit if there isn't. I'm going to live my life how I want and take whatever happens to me after I die.

I call myself and Apathyist. Stupid made up name.

Edit: I guess that would be a Non-theist

Edit: And I thought Catholic WAS Christian, yet it is listed seperate.
Others such as Babtist, Methodist, blah blah were Christian too, and I thought Catholic was too.

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Post by RadicalDreamer » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:01 am

Edit: And I thought Catholic WAS Christian, yet it is listed seperate.
Others such as Babtist, Methodist, blah blah were Christian too, and I thought Catholic was too.
Yes. It is. Tell anyone who tells you differently to shove it.

Yeah, I'm fed up with it. Can you tell?

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Post by sneaky ninja » Tue Feb 17, 2004 2:15 am

There's a difference between Catholic and Protestant, and there's NO difference between Catholic and Christian, although people often assume that for whatever reason :?

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Post by ChronoSword » Tue Feb 17, 2004 3:59 am

Catholics are Christians. The difference between Catholics and Protestants is in theology. However, the same kind of differences are within protestanism itself. I learned this today, some of the differences between the 2 have been cleared up. (ie justification and whether Catholicism is the only way to heaven [Catholics now accept protestantism as a way to heaven]).

I guess no one is Eastern Orthodox since it has not been brought up. But, apparently there is some bad blood between them and the Catholics.

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